Post by johnnyreb on Nov 27, 2007 20:01:49 GMT
One of the last interviews with Hughie 
Brother.
from Classic Rock Revisited:
Silver Stages & Golden Curtains
Jeb: Why did you wait so long to return to the Outlaws?
Hughie: I was having a great time with the Skynyrd boys; I love those guys to death. I just felt like I needed to do something different. I wanted to get back to singing. I really didn't do any singing with Skynyrd; I was hired to be a guitar player. I wanted to get back to doing what I love to do. It was a great nine years with them and I really do love them and I wish them nothing but the best. I really do hope we can get together someday. I look at it like I got to play with two of my favorite bands, Skynyrd and the Outlaws.
Skynyrd is out with Hank Junior and 38 Special and their shows are doing well. I talked to Johnny a while back. I was in the studio working on our new album. I went outside to listen to some of the rough mixes in my truck. I turned on the radio and there he was. I called him and left him a message and when he was done with the interview he called me back. We talked for quite a while and had a few laughs. I told him I was calling him to tell the story on the radio of when his dad and brothers left him on a tree stump in the swamp because he wouldn't pee out of the boat, as he was little and he was too scared. So they took him over to a tree stump and let him pee and then they left him there for about an hour. He wished I would have gotten through because he said he would have told that on the air. He doesn't have any trouble going now but he has been traumatized ever since.
Jeb: That family has an amazing legacy.
Hughie: He is from a great family. Ronnie and Donnie had great bands. Johnny had the Johnny Van Zant Band before Skynyrd and they opened for the Outlaws. We did a few tours with him. He has been around and he has done it all. All the brothers are just as talented as can be.
Jeb: I am a huge Southern Rock fan. There was something about Skynyrd with you and Rickey Medlocke and Gary Rossington. Nothing can replace the original line up but this was an amazing version of the band.
Hughie: Rickey and I worked really hard to recreate the guitar parts true to their original conception. Gary was nice enough to let us put our own little touch on it. The three of us spent a lot of time together working on those songs. I think that is why you feel that way about it and I certainly appreciate that because we did work hard at remembering who Lynyrd Skynyrd was and what they were like. We wanted to do it right and make it great.
Jeb: I talked to Rickey a while back and I asked him if I would ever see him play another Blackfoot show.
Hughie: Gary talked about doing a Blackfoot, Outlaws and Skynyrd concert. We kept waiting and waiting but it never happened. Maybe the fans can put some pressure on the powers that be and we can do that soon. Throw in 38 Special and you would have one hell of a concert tour.
Jeb: Was there ever a time you were on stage and in your mind you were thinking, "I am playing **** ing 'Freebird' with Lynyrd Skynyrd."
Hughie: I felt that way every night. I looked out to the hardworking people who would come to the shows and I would think how lucky I was to be in this band. The fans loved the music and they responded to it and it made us play that much harder. It's not about the money and the fame and all the other stuff. It's about playing to the people and when they respond like that it just sets us on fire. When you start getting it back from the crowd you just keep giving and giving and giving back because you want to, not because you have to. You do it because you love to do it and they appreciate it and you can feel the love.
Jeb: How long did you struggle about leaving Skynyrd?
Hughie: Not very long. I was only supposed to be with them for six months and I ended up staying for nine years. I really didn't plan it. The end of the year was coming and I knew they were going to take a break for a while. I knew that it was time to tell the guys that it had been a great nine years. I told them that if they ever wanted to play again all they had to do was call. I had been listening to Outlaws' music and I had actually written a bunch of Outlaws songs while I was out on the road with Skynyrd. I decided that I needed to go and do this now. The Force kind of told me to do it. The Big Guy said, "Now."
Jeb: Medlocke didn't do it. He stuck around.
Hughie: Rickey's old band, Blackfoot, is out playing. Last November we played a show with them along with Charlie Daniels and Molly Hatchet. Rickey wasn't there but they still sounded like Blackfoot and I really liked them. We played and then Charlie took the stage and I don't have to tell you about him. Sparks started flying from his fingertips.
Jeb: How big a chore was it to get the Outlaws back together?
Hughie: That took a little bit of work because I wanted to get as many original members back together as I could. I called our old manager, Charlie Brusco, and we had a conference call with everyone. We also talked to Chris Anderson, who played with us back in the Eighties for four or five years. Henry Paul came back for a year for the reunion but he decided that he wanted to go back to his Country career. We are now a five-piece band; The Guitar Army Rides again.
Jeb: You also have hinted that there is a new album on the way.
Hughie: We thought we were done with it but we went back to record one more song. Chris Hicks, he plays with Marshall Tucker now but he used to be in the Outlaws, brought me this song from a friend of his called "Strange Dream." He told me, "HT, I think you should listen to this as I think you will like it." I listened to it and I have to tell you it is a great song. I didn't write it but when I heard it I knew that it had to be on this record. We are going back and remixing three of the twelve songs that are on there. We hear things now that we didn't hear when we were doing it all at once. You hear things differently when you have been away from it for a while. The name of the album is Once an Outlaw. When you turn it over on the back, it says Always an Outlaw. I think it is one of the best albums we have ever recorded. It is right up there with our first album, Ghost Riders and Hurry Sundown. It has the songs and it has the feel.
We finally got to record an album at home in Tampa. I have been wanting to do that for years. There is a great studio here called Morrisound Recording. I have known Jill and Tom Morris since the early 70's. We cut demos for our records there but we could never get the record company to let us do our records there. They would always have us in Los Angeles or Chicago or Miami - anywhere but Tampa. This time I just decided that we were going to take it home. This is where we played the teen centers and did the battle of the bands and this is where we wrote the songs. I knew it was time to bring it home so that is what I did.
Jeb: How do you describe the style of the Outlaws' music? You play rock, blues and jazz - sometimes all in the same song.
Hughie: A lot of the songs on our new record are a hybrid just like you described. Country music is now all about what we were doing in 1975 in some aspects. They have discovered the snare drum, the lead electric Fender guitar and three part harmonies. We did all of that stuff back then. We are called Southern Rock and they are called Country. We have talked to a lot of Country radio stations who want to hear the release when it comes out. If they want to embrace the Outlaws then it would be great with us. It doesn't matter if you like Southern Rock or Country, I think you find will find something for everyone on this record.
Jeb: You are producing the album too.
Hughie: I am producing it. I helped produce one of the Skynyrd records and I was the co-producer on several Outlaws records but this time it is all on my shoulders. I will let you know next week how it goes!
Jeb: When are you going to release it?
Hughie: I think it will be a couple of months from now. We have some packaging to do and we have a little bit of recording and mixing to do on a couple songs. We are going to service radio stations as soon as we can. I will get you a copy too.
Jeb: Are you selling it yourself or do you have a label?
Hughie: Our manager is talking with several independent record companies and some major labels. We are waiting patiently. We are veterans at this. We don't have to cross our fingers or hold our breath. I know how good this record is and I know our fans are going to receive this record well. I just want to make sure we have a way to get it to them. If I have to put it in their hand myself I will do it.
Jeb: What was so magical about the Florida area back when the Southern Rock movement started?
Hughie: I think it all started with Skynyrd. We were fortunate enough to be on tour with them in '75 and '76, right up until the plane crash. They started the ball rolling. Maybe there is something in the water. Mollly Hatchet is from Florida. Tom Petty is from Gainesville. A lot of great bands came from Florida. Maybe it's the heat.
Jeb: You were gigging the same time as Skynyrd.
Hughie: Leon Wilkeson, Skynyrd's bass player, and I were in a band called The King James Version. We were playing at the Jet Airport Lounge in Fort Lauderdale. We played literally at the end of the runway. Jets would fly over and drown out the music. Leon got a call one night and he told me that Skynyrd had called and that they were going to record their first album and that he had to go. I told him to go, told him I loved him and that I wished him the best. I left the band at the same time and put the Outlaws back together.
The Outlaws actually started in 1968 and I did all these other gigs in between. We were fortunate enough to win the Battle of the Bands contest and we got to make our first record in Tampa. We never sold anything. Someone must have a box of them somewhere. You will get a kick out of the titles of the songs. One of them was called "Goodbye." The flip side was "At the Triple Feature in Cinema Scope and Color at the Drive in Movie Tonight." I am proud to say that we didn't write those songs.
Jeb: I guess you could say the whole thing really started with the Allman Brothers.
Hughie: You're right. I thought we were just talking about Florida bands. They were just right over the boarder. If you throw a rock then you could say they were from Florida. I saw them when they were the Allman Joys. We played a show with them as the Outlaws at a place called The Electric Zoo in St. Petersburg, Florida. It was an afternoon jam and it was free. People would make donations and they had barbecue and band would play. I remember seeing Duane Allman for the first time - I didn't even know what a slide guitar was. They took the stage and opened with "Statesboro Blues" and my jaw hit the floor. I stood there and I told the person I was with, who was trying to get me to leave, "You go. I am staying." I wanted to be like them. I wanted to be that good and I wanted to have that kind of an impact on people. They were smiling and having fun and that is what it is all about.
Jeb: We have to talk about Charlie Daniels.
Hughie: Charlie is playing better guitar than I have ever heard him play and better fiddle as well. He looks great and he sounds great. We had the time of our life on tour with him and Marshall Tucker. At the end of every night we all jam with each other. Charlie invites everyone out to jam with him on "The South's Gonna Do It Again." When Charlie waves that bow you never know who he is going to point it at. You better pay attention.
Jeb: Charlie commands that kind of respect.
Hughie: He does and he deserves it.
Jeb: Why do you think the Southern Rock fans are like a big, extended family?
Hughie: Everyone checks the egos at the door. This is about the music. It is not about me, me, me. It is about playing together and being brothers on the road. We play for the people who come to see us and not for ourselves. We do it for the right reasons. We have been given a gift, a blessing if you will from God, to be able to play music. We are so lucky to get paid to do that. Who can ask for more? We also get to play with our friends like Charlie and the Tucker boys. I couldn't ask for anything more and I wouldn't because it is so close to being right.
Jeb: Southern Rock has very dedicated fans that will drive for miles for a concert.
Hughie: There are also a lot of younger bands that are tribute bands that are doing nothing but Outlaws songs or Skynyrd songs. I have come across some of these bands and they give me their CDs and if I didn't know better I would swear it was me singing. They have taken time to learn the licks off the old records and they know them better than we know them ourselves. They want to learn how to play. I really think that is great and I really think a lot of them. Who knows, maybe someday we will pass the torch to a young Outlaws band and keep the legacy going. I don't see why that shouldn't happen and why that couldn't happen. I will never retire. My hands will always be wrapped around the Outlaws the way my heart is but there may come a point to where I want to produce music but can't play it. I would go to a band like that and give it to them and say, "Alright guys, let's go."
Jeb: I have done a lot of interviews with Southern Rockers and everyone comes off very down to earth. But I find that a lot of guys are too trusting when it comes to the business of music.
Hughie: That is true and that has happened to more than one band like us. The record company thinks they own you and they think they can make you do stuff you don't want to do. They say, "We can make you and we can break you." We don't play by those rules. They may think that but we are still here. If it wasn't for them we would have never been heard and sometimes I just don't understand their logic but we are going to do what we want to do. We are still here and we are going to keep playing the kind of music we love. If we are too trusting then that is too bad. God forgive us for being that way. I don't see anything wrong with being that way. I think more people should be trusting and put their faith in something good. We should all just be happy that we are here and still part of the business.
Jeb: Were you savvy enough not to get screwed over?
Hughie: Yeah but I have also caused myself some problems by getting hot headed and saying things that I shouldn't say. I try not to do that anymore. I try really hard to show respect to those in the business. To gain respect you have to show respect. It is a whole new day and era now and we are doing things differently.
Jeb: I have to ask you the story behind "Green Grass & High Tides."
Hughie: I was in St. Augustine, Florida. I had gone up there to stay at a friend of mines beach house. We went up there for the weekend strictly to relax so we didn't take any guitars. On Saturday night everyone had gone to bed and I couldn't sleep. I was just sitting up and thinking of all these great musicians who are no longer with us like Jimi Hendrix and Janis Joplin. I just wondered what they were doing. I came up with "In a place you only dream of where your soul is always free / silver stages, golden curtains filled my head plain as can be." I wrote the lyrics that night without a guitar but I had the music in my head. On Monday, I got with the guys in the band and started putting it together. It developed over the years. It went from being three minutes long to what you hear on the first record to the seventeen-minute version on the live record. The band helped it evolve - I didn't do that all myself. We kept expanding it and it kept getting bigger and bigger.
The first recording we did of the song was for Arista Records in California. Paul Rothchild was the producer. He produced the Doors. We had done the long version of "Green Grass & High Tides" which we thought was a short version. I walked into the control room and he had two-inch tape around his neck, laying on the floor and all over the chairs and I go, "Paul, what are you doing?" He said, "I am editing 'Green Grass', I want to make it shorter." My heart came up into my throat, I felt sick to my stomach and I thought I was going to die. He put it back together and it came out as the version that came out on the record. He cut out the fat and he kept the meat. We have a tendency to play too long on the solos. We couldn't do it any other way. He was wise enough to let us do it the way we did it and then do his job. We recorded it live, we all played at the same time.
On the new record we did it that way. I think it makes the energy much better. You can go in and play over-dub after over-dub and get the perfect drum track, and I have done that many times in my career, but I have found out that it is always better if the band plays it all together. You have to go in well rehearsed to do that. You can't go into the studio not knowing your songs. We spent two weeks rehearsing before we ever stepped into the studios.
Jeb: Are you a student of the guitar?
Hughie: I learned to play by ear; I can't read music. My mom bought me my guitar on my eighth birthday. I took lessons for fifty cents a half an hour. I did this for six weeks with a man named Elwood Ferguson in Virginia. After that I was on my own. I would listen to whatever it was that I wanted to learn and I would pick it out note-by-note and chord-by-chord. As time went by I got quicker at it. It is a natural thing for me to play that way.
Jeb: Guitar players have a signature sound but you have about five signature sounds.
Hughie: That comes from not looking at a piece of paper. I went up and did a couple of songs for DreamWorks for these guys that were making a CD for Bike Week. I went into the studio and one of these cats comes over and hands me what they call a number sheet. I looked at him and said, "Thank you but that is not going to do me very much good." He shook his head and walked away. I nailed the song on the first take. The second song took me two takes. It is just something you learn to do. Once you learn it then you can't change it. That brain cell is still working.
Jeb: I knew the song "Ghost Riders in the Sky" from my Grandpa playing it.
Hughie: We are opening with that on tour. Everyone, including kids under ten-years-old, knows that song. I met the man's son and his wife who wrote that song. His name is Stan Jones. He was in a lot of John Wayne movies. We were in the studio with Ron Nevison working on the Ghost Rider record in L.A. but it wasn't called the Ghost Rider record yet. We were at The Record Plant. We had cut all the songs that we thought we were going to cut and Nevison comes up to us and says, "We still ain't got the one." I looked at him and said, "What?" The album had a bunch of great songs on it like "Angels High" and "Devil's Road." Ron was a great producer and he just said, "I'm sorry but I don't hear it. We don't have the song that you guys need." One of my crew guys wised off and said, "Well why don't you just play 'Witch Doctor.'" I stood up and said, "Well how about 'Ghost Riders in the Sky.'" He got this look on his face and he looked straight at me and he said, "That's it Hughie." We spent the next three days working the song up and it became the title track of the record.
Jeb: That is an amazing story.
Hughie: It is like being put in a corner - you have to fight your way out. That really was out of the blue. I was being a wise ass and without knowing it I said the song that we needed to do.
Jeb: After you release this album are you going to hit the road alone or are you going to package up another tour?
Hughie: They are talking about another package tour for next year but we have shows of our own too. We did that on the Volunteer Jam tour. If we had a few days off then we would play our own shows. We are going to play year round. We are going to play this winter. We are going to keep writing and recording too. We are not going to stop just because we have this record done. We are going to record a song or two songs at a time. With downloads being what they are now you don't need to have complete CDs for people to enjoy your music. I think if you have two songs that are ready to go then let people download them. Eventually we will do another CD but in the meantime we will follow up this CD and release a new song or two every few months. We are not going to let off; we are going to whip that horse.
Jeb: What did you do before you spent nine years with Skynyrd? Were the Outlaws together the whole time?
Hughie: I was with them from 1968 until then. I had a couple of different versions of the band over time. When I went with Skynyrd a couple of the guys, Chris Hicks and BB Borden, who were in the Outlaws, went with Marshall Tucker. We talked about them coming back to the band but they had the gig with Tucker. It worked out great.
Jeb: Does it bother you that Henry didn't stick around?
Hughie: It doesn't bother me. I think the guitar playing was more than he could bear. Henry loves playing Country music and that is where he is the happiest. I was somewhat disappointed when he said he was leaving but we just backed up and regrouped and went on.
Jeb: Are you 100% in the driver's seat when it comes to the Outlaws now?
Hughie: I would say yeah. I always try to include the band in any major decisions. I would rather us be a band and be happy then for me to be the boss and have everyone be miserable. I won't ask my band members to do anything that I wouldn't do.
Jeb: Tell me about the first gig with the Outlaws after leaving Skynyrd.
Hughie: Honestly, I don't remember. We did sixty or seventy shows. We did a bunch of rehearsals. We also did a couple of buyers show. I don't remember where it was but I do remember that I had butterflies. I was apprehensive. I knew the band was good because we had rehearsed. My main concern was my vocals because I hadn't sung in a long while. It actually took a lot longer than I anticipated for it to come back. I struggled with it for a little while. I was having to warm up and drink tea and honey to keep my vocals chords from swelling up. When you don't use them for a long time then they will swell up and cause you trouble. Henry and Chris were singing back then so I wasn't singing the whole set like I pretty much am now. My butterflies went away real quick once I hit the stage.
Jeb: People at an Outlaws audience just stand there and watch with their eyes wide at the talent you guys have on stage. Then you change gears and play "There Goes Another Love Song" and everyone is dancing.
Hughie: They recognize that song. We are there to play for the audience and we try to make sure that they have a good time. When I see the audience, get fired up I just get crazy. When they give it back to me then I just play my heart out for them.
Jeb: Southern Rockers were famous for heavy partying.
Hughie: Those days have gone by for us. We have figured out that the music is more important than the parties. We have all gotten older and wiser but that is not to say that we have not had our day in the past. The sad part about that is that a lot of my friends are not alive because of that. I look at it like I am fortunate to have lived through that and smart enough not to go back to it.
Jeb: We have lost a lot of guys.
Hughie: This business seems to go hand in hand with the glitz and glamour but that is really not true. If you talk to Charlie and his band or the Tucker guys and you will find out that was then and this is now. We are not the same people we were emotionally or mentally. We are a lot stronger and we can say no. Everyone wants to give you something but you just have to be able to say, "Thank you very much but I am here to play for you guys. You guys have a good time and enjoy it."
Jeb: I get asked all the time what it is like to go backstage...
Hughie: It's not like people think it is. People are warming up on guitars and vocals getting ready for the show. It is nothing like it was in the old days.
Jeb: I tell people that groupies and drugs have been replaced by family and food.
Hughie: [laughter] Absolutely! It is pretty much in that order!
Jeb: Dave Hlubek of Molly Hatchet is a buddy of mine. How did you feel when you heard the Outlaws were paid homage to in the Hatchet song "Gator Country?"
Hughie: I know Dave very well. Some people change and some people don't. We were pleasantly surprised because they were not so kind to everyone else. We did several tours together with them and became very close friends.
Jeb: Last one: Legend holds that you were there the night Hlubek and Danny Joe Brown had their famous fight.
Hughie: They went to fisticuffs. Ronnie used to do that in Skynyrd too. I would get invited out on stage to play with them back in the old days. I would do "T for Texas" or "Sweet Home Alabama" at the end of the set. If anyone would miss a note or anything would go wrong then when they came off stage and went to the dressing room and were getting ready for the encore, there would be a fistfight. I ran out of their dressing room more than once just to get out of the way of flying chairs or bottles. Everyone has grown up. I imagine even the Hatchet boys have grown up by now.
www.outlawsmusic.com
Brother.from Classic Rock Revisited:
Silver Stages & Golden Curtains
Jeb: Why did you wait so long to return to the Outlaws?
Hughie: I was having a great time with the Skynyrd boys; I love those guys to death. I just felt like I needed to do something different. I wanted to get back to singing. I really didn't do any singing with Skynyrd; I was hired to be a guitar player. I wanted to get back to doing what I love to do. It was a great nine years with them and I really do love them and I wish them nothing but the best. I really do hope we can get together someday. I look at it like I got to play with two of my favorite bands, Skynyrd and the Outlaws.
Skynyrd is out with Hank Junior and 38 Special and their shows are doing well. I talked to Johnny a while back. I was in the studio working on our new album. I went outside to listen to some of the rough mixes in my truck. I turned on the radio and there he was. I called him and left him a message and when he was done with the interview he called me back. We talked for quite a while and had a few laughs. I told him I was calling him to tell the story on the radio of when his dad and brothers left him on a tree stump in the swamp because he wouldn't pee out of the boat, as he was little and he was too scared. So they took him over to a tree stump and let him pee and then they left him there for about an hour. He wished I would have gotten through because he said he would have told that on the air. He doesn't have any trouble going now but he has been traumatized ever since.
Jeb: That family has an amazing legacy.
Hughie: He is from a great family. Ronnie and Donnie had great bands. Johnny had the Johnny Van Zant Band before Skynyrd and they opened for the Outlaws. We did a few tours with him. He has been around and he has done it all. All the brothers are just as talented as can be.
Jeb: I am a huge Southern Rock fan. There was something about Skynyrd with you and Rickey Medlocke and Gary Rossington. Nothing can replace the original line up but this was an amazing version of the band.
Hughie: Rickey and I worked really hard to recreate the guitar parts true to their original conception. Gary was nice enough to let us put our own little touch on it. The three of us spent a lot of time together working on those songs. I think that is why you feel that way about it and I certainly appreciate that because we did work hard at remembering who Lynyrd Skynyrd was and what they were like. We wanted to do it right and make it great.
Jeb: I talked to Rickey a while back and I asked him if I would ever see him play another Blackfoot show.
Hughie: Gary talked about doing a Blackfoot, Outlaws and Skynyrd concert. We kept waiting and waiting but it never happened. Maybe the fans can put some pressure on the powers that be and we can do that soon. Throw in 38 Special and you would have one hell of a concert tour.
Jeb: Was there ever a time you were on stage and in your mind you were thinking, "I am playing **** ing 'Freebird' with Lynyrd Skynyrd."
Hughie: I felt that way every night. I looked out to the hardworking people who would come to the shows and I would think how lucky I was to be in this band. The fans loved the music and they responded to it and it made us play that much harder. It's not about the money and the fame and all the other stuff. It's about playing to the people and when they respond like that it just sets us on fire. When you start getting it back from the crowd you just keep giving and giving and giving back because you want to, not because you have to. You do it because you love to do it and they appreciate it and you can feel the love.
Jeb: How long did you struggle about leaving Skynyrd?
Hughie: Not very long. I was only supposed to be with them for six months and I ended up staying for nine years. I really didn't plan it. The end of the year was coming and I knew they were going to take a break for a while. I knew that it was time to tell the guys that it had been a great nine years. I told them that if they ever wanted to play again all they had to do was call. I had been listening to Outlaws' music and I had actually written a bunch of Outlaws songs while I was out on the road with Skynyrd. I decided that I needed to go and do this now. The Force kind of told me to do it. The Big Guy said, "Now."
Jeb: Medlocke didn't do it. He stuck around.
Hughie: Rickey's old band, Blackfoot, is out playing. Last November we played a show with them along with Charlie Daniels and Molly Hatchet. Rickey wasn't there but they still sounded like Blackfoot and I really liked them. We played and then Charlie took the stage and I don't have to tell you about him. Sparks started flying from his fingertips.
Jeb: How big a chore was it to get the Outlaws back together?
Hughie: That took a little bit of work because I wanted to get as many original members back together as I could. I called our old manager, Charlie Brusco, and we had a conference call with everyone. We also talked to Chris Anderson, who played with us back in the Eighties for four or five years. Henry Paul came back for a year for the reunion but he decided that he wanted to go back to his Country career. We are now a five-piece band; The Guitar Army Rides again.
Jeb: You also have hinted that there is a new album on the way.
Hughie: We thought we were done with it but we went back to record one more song. Chris Hicks, he plays with Marshall Tucker now but he used to be in the Outlaws, brought me this song from a friend of his called "Strange Dream." He told me, "HT, I think you should listen to this as I think you will like it." I listened to it and I have to tell you it is a great song. I didn't write it but when I heard it I knew that it had to be on this record. We are going back and remixing three of the twelve songs that are on there. We hear things now that we didn't hear when we were doing it all at once. You hear things differently when you have been away from it for a while. The name of the album is Once an Outlaw. When you turn it over on the back, it says Always an Outlaw. I think it is one of the best albums we have ever recorded. It is right up there with our first album, Ghost Riders and Hurry Sundown. It has the songs and it has the feel.
We finally got to record an album at home in Tampa. I have been wanting to do that for years. There is a great studio here called Morrisound Recording. I have known Jill and Tom Morris since the early 70's. We cut demos for our records there but we could never get the record company to let us do our records there. They would always have us in Los Angeles or Chicago or Miami - anywhere but Tampa. This time I just decided that we were going to take it home. This is where we played the teen centers and did the battle of the bands and this is where we wrote the songs. I knew it was time to bring it home so that is what I did.
Jeb: How do you describe the style of the Outlaws' music? You play rock, blues and jazz - sometimes all in the same song.
Hughie: A lot of the songs on our new record are a hybrid just like you described. Country music is now all about what we were doing in 1975 in some aspects. They have discovered the snare drum, the lead electric Fender guitar and three part harmonies. We did all of that stuff back then. We are called Southern Rock and they are called Country. We have talked to a lot of Country radio stations who want to hear the release when it comes out. If they want to embrace the Outlaws then it would be great with us. It doesn't matter if you like Southern Rock or Country, I think you find will find something for everyone on this record.
Jeb: You are producing the album too.
Hughie: I am producing it. I helped produce one of the Skynyrd records and I was the co-producer on several Outlaws records but this time it is all on my shoulders. I will let you know next week how it goes!
Jeb: When are you going to release it?
Hughie: I think it will be a couple of months from now. We have some packaging to do and we have a little bit of recording and mixing to do on a couple songs. We are going to service radio stations as soon as we can. I will get you a copy too.
Jeb: Are you selling it yourself or do you have a label?
Hughie: Our manager is talking with several independent record companies and some major labels. We are waiting patiently. We are veterans at this. We don't have to cross our fingers or hold our breath. I know how good this record is and I know our fans are going to receive this record well. I just want to make sure we have a way to get it to them. If I have to put it in their hand myself I will do it.
Jeb: What was so magical about the Florida area back when the Southern Rock movement started?
Hughie: I think it all started with Skynyrd. We were fortunate enough to be on tour with them in '75 and '76, right up until the plane crash. They started the ball rolling. Maybe there is something in the water. Mollly Hatchet is from Florida. Tom Petty is from Gainesville. A lot of great bands came from Florida. Maybe it's the heat.
Jeb: You were gigging the same time as Skynyrd.
Hughie: Leon Wilkeson, Skynyrd's bass player, and I were in a band called The King James Version. We were playing at the Jet Airport Lounge in Fort Lauderdale. We played literally at the end of the runway. Jets would fly over and drown out the music. Leon got a call one night and he told me that Skynyrd had called and that they were going to record their first album and that he had to go. I told him to go, told him I loved him and that I wished him the best. I left the band at the same time and put the Outlaws back together.
The Outlaws actually started in 1968 and I did all these other gigs in between. We were fortunate enough to win the Battle of the Bands contest and we got to make our first record in Tampa. We never sold anything. Someone must have a box of them somewhere. You will get a kick out of the titles of the songs. One of them was called "Goodbye." The flip side was "At the Triple Feature in Cinema Scope and Color at the Drive in Movie Tonight." I am proud to say that we didn't write those songs.
Jeb: I guess you could say the whole thing really started with the Allman Brothers.
Hughie: You're right. I thought we were just talking about Florida bands. They were just right over the boarder. If you throw a rock then you could say they were from Florida. I saw them when they were the Allman Joys. We played a show with them as the Outlaws at a place called The Electric Zoo in St. Petersburg, Florida. It was an afternoon jam and it was free. People would make donations and they had barbecue and band would play. I remember seeing Duane Allman for the first time - I didn't even know what a slide guitar was. They took the stage and opened with "Statesboro Blues" and my jaw hit the floor. I stood there and I told the person I was with, who was trying to get me to leave, "You go. I am staying." I wanted to be like them. I wanted to be that good and I wanted to have that kind of an impact on people. They were smiling and having fun and that is what it is all about.
Jeb: We have to talk about Charlie Daniels.
Hughie: Charlie is playing better guitar than I have ever heard him play and better fiddle as well. He looks great and he sounds great. We had the time of our life on tour with him and Marshall Tucker. At the end of every night we all jam with each other. Charlie invites everyone out to jam with him on "The South's Gonna Do It Again." When Charlie waves that bow you never know who he is going to point it at. You better pay attention.
Jeb: Charlie commands that kind of respect.
Hughie: He does and he deserves it.
Jeb: Why do you think the Southern Rock fans are like a big, extended family?
Hughie: Everyone checks the egos at the door. This is about the music. It is not about me, me, me. It is about playing together and being brothers on the road. We play for the people who come to see us and not for ourselves. We do it for the right reasons. We have been given a gift, a blessing if you will from God, to be able to play music. We are so lucky to get paid to do that. Who can ask for more? We also get to play with our friends like Charlie and the Tucker boys. I couldn't ask for anything more and I wouldn't because it is so close to being right.
Jeb: Southern Rock has very dedicated fans that will drive for miles for a concert.
Hughie: There are also a lot of younger bands that are tribute bands that are doing nothing but Outlaws songs or Skynyrd songs. I have come across some of these bands and they give me their CDs and if I didn't know better I would swear it was me singing. They have taken time to learn the licks off the old records and they know them better than we know them ourselves. They want to learn how to play. I really think that is great and I really think a lot of them. Who knows, maybe someday we will pass the torch to a young Outlaws band and keep the legacy going. I don't see why that shouldn't happen and why that couldn't happen. I will never retire. My hands will always be wrapped around the Outlaws the way my heart is but there may come a point to where I want to produce music but can't play it. I would go to a band like that and give it to them and say, "Alright guys, let's go."
Jeb: I have done a lot of interviews with Southern Rockers and everyone comes off very down to earth. But I find that a lot of guys are too trusting when it comes to the business of music.
Hughie: That is true and that has happened to more than one band like us. The record company thinks they own you and they think they can make you do stuff you don't want to do. They say, "We can make you and we can break you." We don't play by those rules. They may think that but we are still here. If it wasn't for them we would have never been heard and sometimes I just don't understand their logic but we are going to do what we want to do. We are still here and we are going to keep playing the kind of music we love. If we are too trusting then that is too bad. God forgive us for being that way. I don't see anything wrong with being that way. I think more people should be trusting and put their faith in something good. We should all just be happy that we are here and still part of the business.
Jeb: Were you savvy enough not to get screwed over?
Hughie: Yeah but I have also caused myself some problems by getting hot headed and saying things that I shouldn't say. I try not to do that anymore. I try really hard to show respect to those in the business. To gain respect you have to show respect. It is a whole new day and era now and we are doing things differently.
Jeb: I have to ask you the story behind "Green Grass & High Tides."
Hughie: I was in St. Augustine, Florida. I had gone up there to stay at a friend of mines beach house. We went up there for the weekend strictly to relax so we didn't take any guitars. On Saturday night everyone had gone to bed and I couldn't sleep. I was just sitting up and thinking of all these great musicians who are no longer with us like Jimi Hendrix and Janis Joplin. I just wondered what they were doing. I came up with "In a place you only dream of where your soul is always free / silver stages, golden curtains filled my head plain as can be." I wrote the lyrics that night without a guitar but I had the music in my head. On Monday, I got with the guys in the band and started putting it together. It developed over the years. It went from being three minutes long to what you hear on the first record to the seventeen-minute version on the live record. The band helped it evolve - I didn't do that all myself. We kept expanding it and it kept getting bigger and bigger.
The first recording we did of the song was for Arista Records in California. Paul Rothchild was the producer. He produced the Doors. We had done the long version of "Green Grass & High Tides" which we thought was a short version. I walked into the control room and he had two-inch tape around his neck, laying on the floor and all over the chairs and I go, "Paul, what are you doing?" He said, "I am editing 'Green Grass', I want to make it shorter." My heart came up into my throat, I felt sick to my stomach and I thought I was going to die. He put it back together and it came out as the version that came out on the record. He cut out the fat and he kept the meat. We have a tendency to play too long on the solos. We couldn't do it any other way. He was wise enough to let us do it the way we did it and then do his job. We recorded it live, we all played at the same time.
On the new record we did it that way. I think it makes the energy much better. You can go in and play over-dub after over-dub and get the perfect drum track, and I have done that many times in my career, but I have found out that it is always better if the band plays it all together. You have to go in well rehearsed to do that. You can't go into the studio not knowing your songs. We spent two weeks rehearsing before we ever stepped into the studios.
Jeb: Are you a student of the guitar?
Hughie: I learned to play by ear; I can't read music. My mom bought me my guitar on my eighth birthday. I took lessons for fifty cents a half an hour. I did this for six weeks with a man named Elwood Ferguson in Virginia. After that I was on my own. I would listen to whatever it was that I wanted to learn and I would pick it out note-by-note and chord-by-chord. As time went by I got quicker at it. It is a natural thing for me to play that way.
Jeb: Guitar players have a signature sound but you have about five signature sounds.
Hughie: That comes from not looking at a piece of paper. I went up and did a couple of songs for DreamWorks for these guys that were making a CD for Bike Week. I went into the studio and one of these cats comes over and hands me what they call a number sheet. I looked at him and said, "Thank you but that is not going to do me very much good." He shook his head and walked away. I nailed the song on the first take. The second song took me two takes. It is just something you learn to do. Once you learn it then you can't change it. That brain cell is still working.
Jeb: I knew the song "Ghost Riders in the Sky" from my Grandpa playing it.
Hughie: We are opening with that on tour. Everyone, including kids under ten-years-old, knows that song. I met the man's son and his wife who wrote that song. His name is Stan Jones. He was in a lot of John Wayne movies. We were in the studio with Ron Nevison working on the Ghost Rider record in L.A. but it wasn't called the Ghost Rider record yet. We were at The Record Plant. We had cut all the songs that we thought we were going to cut and Nevison comes up to us and says, "We still ain't got the one." I looked at him and said, "What?" The album had a bunch of great songs on it like "Angels High" and "Devil's Road." Ron was a great producer and he just said, "I'm sorry but I don't hear it. We don't have the song that you guys need." One of my crew guys wised off and said, "Well why don't you just play 'Witch Doctor.'" I stood up and said, "Well how about 'Ghost Riders in the Sky.'" He got this look on his face and he looked straight at me and he said, "That's it Hughie." We spent the next three days working the song up and it became the title track of the record.
Jeb: That is an amazing story.
Hughie: It is like being put in a corner - you have to fight your way out. That really was out of the blue. I was being a wise ass and without knowing it I said the song that we needed to do.
Jeb: After you release this album are you going to hit the road alone or are you going to package up another tour?
Hughie: They are talking about another package tour for next year but we have shows of our own too. We did that on the Volunteer Jam tour. If we had a few days off then we would play our own shows. We are going to play year round. We are going to play this winter. We are going to keep writing and recording too. We are not going to stop just because we have this record done. We are going to record a song or two songs at a time. With downloads being what they are now you don't need to have complete CDs for people to enjoy your music. I think if you have two songs that are ready to go then let people download them. Eventually we will do another CD but in the meantime we will follow up this CD and release a new song or two every few months. We are not going to let off; we are going to whip that horse.
Jeb: What did you do before you spent nine years with Skynyrd? Were the Outlaws together the whole time?
Hughie: I was with them from 1968 until then. I had a couple of different versions of the band over time. When I went with Skynyrd a couple of the guys, Chris Hicks and BB Borden, who were in the Outlaws, went with Marshall Tucker. We talked about them coming back to the band but they had the gig with Tucker. It worked out great.
Jeb: Does it bother you that Henry didn't stick around?
Hughie: It doesn't bother me. I think the guitar playing was more than he could bear. Henry loves playing Country music and that is where he is the happiest. I was somewhat disappointed when he said he was leaving but we just backed up and regrouped and went on.
Jeb: Are you 100% in the driver's seat when it comes to the Outlaws now?
Hughie: I would say yeah. I always try to include the band in any major decisions. I would rather us be a band and be happy then for me to be the boss and have everyone be miserable. I won't ask my band members to do anything that I wouldn't do.
Jeb: Tell me about the first gig with the Outlaws after leaving Skynyrd.
Hughie: Honestly, I don't remember. We did sixty or seventy shows. We did a bunch of rehearsals. We also did a couple of buyers show. I don't remember where it was but I do remember that I had butterflies. I was apprehensive. I knew the band was good because we had rehearsed. My main concern was my vocals because I hadn't sung in a long while. It actually took a lot longer than I anticipated for it to come back. I struggled with it for a little while. I was having to warm up and drink tea and honey to keep my vocals chords from swelling up. When you don't use them for a long time then they will swell up and cause you trouble. Henry and Chris were singing back then so I wasn't singing the whole set like I pretty much am now. My butterflies went away real quick once I hit the stage.
Jeb: People at an Outlaws audience just stand there and watch with their eyes wide at the talent you guys have on stage. Then you change gears and play "There Goes Another Love Song" and everyone is dancing.
Hughie: They recognize that song. We are there to play for the audience and we try to make sure that they have a good time. When I see the audience, get fired up I just get crazy. When they give it back to me then I just play my heart out for them.
Jeb: Southern Rockers were famous for heavy partying.
Hughie: Those days have gone by for us. We have figured out that the music is more important than the parties. We have all gotten older and wiser but that is not to say that we have not had our day in the past. The sad part about that is that a lot of my friends are not alive because of that. I look at it like I am fortunate to have lived through that and smart enough not to go back to it.
Jeb: We have lost a lot of guys.
Hughie: This business seems to go hand in hand with the glitz and glamour but that is really not true. If you talk to Charlie and his band or the Tucker guys and you will find out that was then and this is now. We are not the same people we were emotionally or mentally. We are a lot stronger and we can say no. Everyone wants to give you something but you just have to be able to say, "Thank you very much but I am here to play for you guys. You guys have a good time and enjoy it."
Jeb: I get asked all the time what it is like to go backstage...
Hughie: It's not like people think it is. People are warming up on guitars and vocals getting ready for the show. It is nothing like it was in the old days.
Jeb: I tell people that groupies and drugs have been replaced by family and food.
Hughie: [laughter] Absolutely! It is pretty much in that order!
Jeb: Dave Hlubek of Molly Hatchet is a buddy of mine. How did you feel when you heard the Outlaws were paid homage to in the Hatchet song "Gator Country?"
Hughie: I know Dave very well. Some people change and some people don't. We were pleasantly surprised because they were not so kind to everyone else. We did several tours together with them and became very close friends.
Jeb: Last one: Legend holds that you were there the night Hlubek and Danny Joe Brown had their famous fight.
Hughie: They went to fisticuffs. Ronnie used to do that in Skynyrd too. I would get invited out on stage to play with them back in the old days. I would do "T for Texas" or "Sweet Home Alabama" at the end of the set. If anyone would miss a note or anything would go wrong then when they came off stage and went to the dressing room and were getting ready for the encore, there would be a fistfight. I ran out of their dressing room more than once just to get out of the way of flying chairs or bottles. Everyone has grown up. I imagine even the Hatchet boys have grown up by now.
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